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The Scottish Pool Association Ľ General Ľ SPA Announcements
2017 Accounts
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  2017 Accounts
by: secretary, 03-12-2018 12:16 PM (#41)

Gerryb wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
knowledge wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
FCBash wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
Who is it and are they independent?


Paul McKendry is the accountant who audits the books.


Thanks, I have asked this on a number of occasion so nice to get a response. One question though, why is his name not actually on the accounts?

One note of caution, although Paul is more than qualified, with the new membership fee coming in he will no longer be independant.


There is no requirement for an independent accountant based on the constitution (which you can't consult).


8. Finance

8.1 The financial year runs from the 1st of Jan to the 31st of December each year, and all financial statements should be prepared on an accruals basis.

8.2 All funds belonging to the SPA should be deposited in accounts that carry the associationís title. All accounts must operate on two signatories, one of whom will be the treasurer and the other a member of the Executive Committee.

8.3 At each SPA meeting the treasurer will present a summary of the associationís ledger accounts showing all income and expenditure since the last meeting.

8.4 After each significant SPA event, the treasurer will produce and present to the next SPA meeting, a summary Income and Expenditure statement for each event.

8.5 Any sub-divisions of the SPA holding their own separate finances and bank accounts are responsible for these accounts. They are required to submit to the SPA treasurer a fully reconciled Income and Expenditure account along with the most recent bank statements, at least three weeks prior to the annual AGM.

8.6 The SPA treasurer will provide consolidated financial statements at least one week prior to each AGM, where they will be verified and passed as accurate.


You have got be kidding with this extract? Who wrote this crap?

There should be no sub divisions of the SPA holding money. Surely budgets are agreed then allocated. or if money is raised its ring fenced as their in the central account?

No requirement for an accountant? There is over 100,000 going through the 2017 books. As a matter of good practice and to provide assurances for the members who pay this money in we should have accounts signed and verified by an independant accountant. Pool has a long way to go yet if it wants to be taken seriously as a sport if this is the way we want to continue.


Smile


Look forward to seeing you on Sunday
secretary
General Member


Posts: 3397
Joined: 14.01.08
Location: Scotland

RE: 2017 Accounts
by: Gerryb, 04-12-2018 01:41 PM (#42)

secretary wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
knowledge wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
FCBash wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
Who is it and are they independent?


Paul McKendry is the accountant who audits the books.


Thanks, I have asked this on a number of occasion so nice to get a response. One question though, why is his name not actually on the accounts?

One note of caution, although Paul is more than qualified, with the new membership fee coming in he will no longer be independant.


There is no requirement for an independent accountant based on the constitution (which you can't consult).


8. Finance

8.1 The financial year runs from the 1st of Jan to the 31st of December each year, and all financial statements should be prepared on an accruals basis.

8.2 All funds belonging to the SPA should be deposited in accounts that carry the associationís title. All accounts must operate on two signatories, one of whom will be the treasurer and the other a member of the Executive Committee.

8.3 At each SPA meeting the treasurer will present a summary of the associationís ledger accounts showing all income and expenditure since the last meeting.

8.4 After each significant SPA event, the treasurer will produce and present to the next SPA meeting, a summary Income and Expenditure statement for each event.

8.5 Any sub-divisions of the SPA holding their own separate finances and bank accounts are responsible for these accounts. They are required to submit to the SPA treasurer a fully reconciled Income and Expenditure account along with the most recent bank statements, at least three weeks prior to the annual AGM.

8.6 The SPA treasurer will provide consolidated financial statements at least one week prior to each AGM, where they will be verified and passed as accurate.


You have got be kidding with this extract? Who wrote this crap?

There should be no sub divisions of the SPA holding money. Surely budgets are agreed then allocated. or if money is raised its ring fenced as their in the central account?

No requirement for an accountant? There is over 100,000 going through the 2017 books. As a matter of good practice and to provide assurances for the members who pay this money in we should have accounts signed and verified by an independant accountant. Pool has a long way to go yet if it wants to be taken seriously as a sport if this is the way we want to continue.


Smile


Look forward to seeing you on Sunday


Do I need to go on Sunday to get the answers to the questions set, not all by me?
Gerryb
General Member


Posts: 480
Joined: 14.01.08
Location: Glasgow
Age: 49

RE: 2017 Accounts
by: smarties, 04-12-2018 04:34 PM (#43)

Gerryb wrote:
secretary wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
knowledge wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
FCBash wrote:
Gerryb wrote:
Who is it and are they independent?


Paul McKendry is the accountant who audits the books.


Thanks, I have asked this on a number of occasion so nice to get a response. One question though, why is his name not actually on the accounts?

One note of caution, although Paul is more than qualified, with the new membership fee coming in he will no longer be independant.


There is no requirement for an independent accountant based on the constitution (which you can't consult).


8. Finance

8.1 The financial year runs from the 1st of Jan to the 31st of December each year, and all financial statements should be prepared on an accruals basis.

8.2 All funds belonging to the SPA should be deposited in accounts that carry the associationís title. All accounts must operate on two signatories, one of whom will be the treasurer and the other a member of the Executive Committee.

8.3 At each SPA meeting the treasurer will present a summary of the associationís ledger accounts showing all income and expenditure since the last meeting.

8.4 After each significant SPA event, the treasurer will produce and present to the next SPA meeting, a summary Income and Expenditure statement for each event.

8.5 Any sub-divisions of the SPA holding their own separate finances and bank accounts are responsible for these accounts. They are required to submit to the SPA treasurer a fully reconciled Income and Expenditure account along with the most recent bank statements, at least three weeks prior to the annual AGM.

8.6 The SPA treasurer will provide consolidated financial statements at least one week prior to each AGM, where they will be verified and passed as accurate.


You have got be kidding with this extract? Who wrote this crap?

There should be no sub divisions of the SPA holding money. Surely budgets are agreed then allocated. or if money is raised its ring fenced as their in the central account?

No requirement for an accountant? There is over 100,000 going through the 2017 books. As a matter of good practice and to provide assurances for the members who pay this money in we should have accounts signed and verified by an independant accountant. Pool has a long way to go yet if it wants to be taken seriously as a sport if this is the way we want to continue.


Smile


Look forward to seeing you on Sunday


Do I need to go on Sunday to get the answers to the questions set, not all by me?


You don't have to Gerry, but it would be good to have the people there that have asked the questions then you can debate the answers you get if you want to. We won't be coming on the net after the meeting debating every answer, this will only be done at the meeting.

Malky.
smarties
General Member


Posts: 859
Joined: 09.03.08
Location: livingston

RE: 2017 Accounts
by: Gerryb, 05-12-2018 08:58 AM (#44)

I dont see there being a debate. The questions should be answered at the meeting together with a post on this thread, then the thread is locked with a message saying any further questions should be directed to? the exec?
Gerryb
General Member


Posts: 480
Joined: 14.01.08
Location: Glasgow
Age: 49

RE: 2017 Accounts
by: FCBash, 17-12-2018 01:23 PM (#45)

Gerryb wrote:
Surely there should be income and expenditure when it comes to events when members are being charged? Not just the one big number.

A full itemised breakdown of the accounts is available and this details every transaction that takes place through the SPA Accounts. This is quite a significant amount of transactions and is simplified for viewing by the members. It essentially cuts out pages upon pages of transactions. However, this is available to any member who wishes to peruse them, these can be requested through a members Area Rep. Such requests should be made to Yvonne Ewing, SPA Tournament Director.



beearraydee wrote:
Why has affiliation income dropped 35% year on year?

Affiliation has not dropped, this was perhaps misleading from the draft accounts first published but has been resolved and updated in the accounts at the last publishing.



beearraydee wrote:
Can we please have a breakdown of 'event income' to an event by event granular level?

A full itemised breakdown of the accounts is available and this details every transaction that takes place through the SPA Accounts. This is quite a significant amount of transactions and is simplified for viewing by the members. It essentially cuts out pages upon pages of transactions. However, this is available to any member who wishes to peruse them, these can be requested through a members Area Rep. Such requests should be made to Yvonne Ewing, SPA Tournament Director.



beearraydee wrote:
What are "Event Costs - other costs" - can we have a breakdown please?

These are costs incurred at events including overheads such as tournament staff, sundries and miscellaneous costs for stationery etc. Refer to previous question for answer relating to breakdown of costs.



beearraydee wrote:
Can we get a breakdown of "international events" please- what specifically are the costs? This is placed right next to the prize money for other events but I suspect this cost is a little different?

This cost directly relates to international events, most notably the international polo tops. Refer to previous question for answer relating to breakdown of costs.



beearraydee wrote:
What are "promoters fees?"

These are the fees paid to the Promoter for the work carried out on behalf of the SPA. These are a direct split of profits generated through the Superleague events. 50% to Promoter and 50% to the SPA



beearraydee wrote:
What is behind the staggering increase of "executive members and team managers expenses" year on year?

There are no expenses incurred by The Executive Committee and this will be updated to reflect this. These costs are related directly to the funding and support of the Team Scotland Y&J, and LD managers.



beearraydee wrote:
Can we please get a breakdown of "fees and subscriptions"- This is more than half of all overhead expenses so this is essential please.

Costs here relate to PoolAPpLie, Drug Testing and EBA Affiliation. Again, please refer to previous responses for the breakdown of costs.



beearraydee wrote:
Why are we paying ~£50 per month for website and domain hosting costs? This could likely be achieved for a fraction of this price.

This is in fact a lower rate than anticipated for the service the SPA have. The SPA does not just host its own website, but also the websites of all sub-domains (leagues) who have taken this up.



beearraydee wrote:
What are the plans for the bulk of the £31k sitting in the bank account?

There is currently no plan at the moment for the funds in the accounts. Although this should be directed towards development of the SPA. The SPA will look to manage these funds as and when the time arises, in consultation with the membership.



beearraydee wrote:
I'm probably being a bit thick as I don't have a background in accounting, but why is there a negative 10k total on the balance sheet when the bank account has £31k in it?

The account sheet is showing the profit/loss made for the year, from 2016 end to 2017 end.



Sting wrote:
So, these are a draft as per the original posting. And will get the final details of the accounts for 2017 in DECEMBER, are you just gonna do the 2018 ones at the same time, surely this cannot be deemed as acceptable?

Due to a data crash some of the information had to be recovered which took some time to do, rest assured the accounts for 2018 will be presented earlier.



tricky wrote:
For the members sake I think each header, ie. "affiliation income" should be defined. eg. income from member leagues and then further broken down by amount paid. eg. 20 leagues @ £100.

A full itemised breakdown of the accounts is available and this details every transaction that takes place through the SPA Accounts. This is quite a significant amount of transactions and is simplified for viewing by the members. It essentially cuts out pages upon pages of transactions. However, this is available to any member who wishes to peruse them, these can be requested through a members Area Rep. Such requests should be made to Yvonne Ewing, SPA Tournament Director.



tricky wrote:
Event income? What events? A full break down is required here without a doubt. What is the income? Entry fees, monies from clubs, venues for sponsorship? A figure alone is utterly meaningless.

See above.



tricky wrote:
Our sponsorship for 2017 was really zero, nada, diddly squat?

Sponsorship is built into the events, again, see previous regarding full breakdown.



tricky wrote:
Breakdown of accommodation costs is a start but it could go further, ie. per event along with associated incomes and pay outs etc.

See previous regarding full breakdown.



tricky wrote:
International Event costs surely needs to be clarified further.

This cost directly relates to international events, most notably the international polo tops. Refer to previous question for answer relating to breakdown of costs.



tricky wrote:
Promoters Fees. Interesting. Would be good to see which events these related to in event specific income & expense accounts.

See previous regarding full breakdown.



tricky wrote:
Fees & subs. What fees and subs? Seem to have risen significantly.

Costs here relate to PoolAPpLie, Drug Testing and EBA Affiliation. Again, please refer to previous responses for the breakdown of costs.



tricky wrote:
Mostly, like others no doubt, I am concerned at the cash balance. I think it requires attention. It's fine to hold cash reserves but:
1.Purpose of reserves?
2.Do you have a target amount or are we just happy for it to grow forever?
3.Who has authority over these monies and what use will be made of them?

4.Who has responsibility for reporting on these reserves when they are used? Do you need to forewarn association members of their use?[/quote]
1. There is currently no plan at the moment for the funds in the accounts. Although this should be directed towards development of the SPA. The SPA will look to manage these funds as and when the time arises, in consultation with the membership.
2. There is no target amount, the funds shall be directed as and when necessary.
3. Authority of the funds lies with the Members, any applications for expenditure shall be reviewed and put to the members accordingly.
4. The Executive Committee and Treasurer have responsibility for reporting expenditure. If possible the Members will be advised of their use in advance of draw down.



thunderbird wrote:
We spent £57K on Accomodation ?

Yes, this was directly related to 8no Superleague events.



thunderbird wrote:
Did I miss the Vegas open ?

No.



Gerryb wrote:
Sub divisions are mentioned in the constitution, where in the accounts is the breakdown of their funds included? Are they included?

The sub-divisions are not included in the SPA accounts at present.



Gerryb wrote:
Does the SPA own the tables used or hire them?

The SPA does not own tables, nor do they pay any costs for hire of tables.
 
SPA IM Secretary
Arbroath & District Match Secretary
FCBash
General Member


Posts: 1857
Joined: 09.12.10
Location: Arbroath

RE: 2017 Accounts
by: FCBash, 17-12-2018 01:24 PM (#46)

This answers the questions raised, the accounts were also discussed at length during the last meeting (December 9th 2018) and brought to a close.


This thread will now be locked.
 
SPA IM Secretary
Arbroath & District Match Secretary
FCBash
General Member


Posts: 1857
Joined: 09.12.10
Location: Arbroath

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